In this series titled Mindset Matters Most, Juan Vasquez of Illusions Painting will be discussing his journey from being a day to day painting contractor to becoming a profitable business owner with a vision for his company. In episode one, Juan discussed his past life, how his business used to look. In episode two, Juan shared the experience that opened his eyes and changed his life. And what happened next? In episode three, Juan deep dove into all the transitions necessary for his business after his mindset changed. In episode four, this episode, Juan will open up the hood and detail what illusion’s painting looks like today.

And in episode five, the final episode, Juan will lay out his thoughts regarding lack of self-confidence and stereotypes and the initiatives he is currently conducting to help lift up other contractors. If you wanna ask Juan questions related to anything in this podcast series, you can do so in our exclusive Pain and Marketing mastermind podcast forum on Facebook. Just Search for painter, marketing mastermind podcast forum on Facebook and request to join the group or type in the URL facebook dot com forward slash groups forward slash painter. Marketing mastermind.

Again, that URL is facebook dot com forward slash groups forward slash painter. Marketing mastermind. There, you can ask Juan questions directly by tagging him with your question. So you can see how anything discussed here applies to your particular painting company. What’s up? Hey, what’s up Brandon? How are we doing? Doing well, man. Episode four. Wow, we’re already here, huh? Wow. Crazy. Huh. Thank you for having me again, man. Yeah. Thanks for conducting the series, man. I’m excited to uh to dig into today, man. I’m excited too.

You know, you got me uh just by listening to what you had to say there and you got to be thinking again, you know, everything that we just talked about and uh things that are going in the company and, and the personal life. So it’s amazing, man. Thank you really thank you so much for allowing me and giving me this opportunity to just kinda, you know, share a little bit of my story. So thank you so much. It’s my, it’s my privilege, man. Um Yeah, I really, I, I really, really enjoy our talks and yeah, for everyone listening, Juan and I tend to talk quite a bit before and after.

So the podcast, we try to make sure we include everything important here, but, but we are friends. So we, there’s a lot of thought that goes into this and it, it really, it really does, doesn’t it? Yeah, it, it kind of throws me for a loop sometimes. So I’ll, I’ll sort of leave him, try, you know, learning myself, right? So we learn from these episodes as well as we dive into this stuff. You know, I think this is just like having a conversation with someone, you know, on a different level at a knee all the time.

So as much as I wanna sit down and prepare myself for it and you’re here and you’re like, oh forgot what I gotta say, what I was gonna say now, it’s just you kind of go with the float. So, uh it, it helps a lot, man. It helps, um it helps us kind of like, um you know, just be prepared for the moment. And so thank you, thank you so much. So, um, yeah, today we’re gonna talk about what we’re doing in our business right now. I know that we talked about myself being 16 years old and you know, being, you know, with the facing to be a, a daddy at 16 years old and then uh not knowing where life is gonna go, you, you know, you’ll start painting um you know, 30 some, no, 20 something years later, 123 years later, you know, here we are, you know, um talking about my life and never thought this would in the wildest dreams, right?

And so, yeah, it’s cool. Thank you so much. So, basically, today, man, we’re gonna talk about uh what we do, what does illusion look like. Um Man, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s hard to know where to start. Uh Right. Let’s go in, let’s go into the systems, right? So, so people listening, you know, that’s one of the things we cover a lot is, is systems processes. Um Let’s, let’s start it from the perspective of, of who you’re targeting. So, for your customer demographic, how you get those projects and then maybe what that, that life cycle looks like for that customer.

And from there, I think we’ll be able to explore everything. Awesome. So, uh as I, you know, explained in the past, uh most of our, most of our clients and our target clients are very small community. So it’s a very high end home community. Um You know, you’re talking about homes, you know, tens of tens of millions of dollars. So um it’s very exclusive. And so uh when we talk about those, um, constantly, I hear a lot of programs that are out there, estimating programs. I’ve used quite a few of them.

Well, we actually brought them to the office and try to use them. But the problem with these jobs that they’re so, um, unique, you know, everyone is so unique that there’s not a lot of repetition. So that’s where it really kind of made it hard for us to use it in the past. Um So what we’ve done uh if we created a uh standard basically, so it’s a sheet of us of understanding what are standard prices. And from there, we can, you know, we can add whether it’s other finishes or different steps to something, but it gives us a base point.

So you guys with this standard is this manual, I, I mean, is this basically, you guys have, for example, a PDF or something and, and you go through and then you sit down and you manually calculate what this is gonna be. So that’s where we’ve been for the last couple of years. Well, more than a couple of years, but the last couple of years, but basically what we’ve learned from when we got uh the first estimating system is that it doesn’t matter how good the estimating system is, you have to do the work of uh you know, inserting everything, creating that, putting all your in your personal information and everything that you have your, you know, your standards and stuff.

And so for us, um it didn’t work out because um we cannot repeat those cells all the time. It was completely different. So what we did at that point is we wanted to have a list and we wanted to have data, every data we could on every aspect that we do. And so that’s, we’ve been recording everything we’ve done for the last couple of years. So now the we got a new system and can we say the names on the here, you can say the names, man?

Ok. So is Jar, so Jobb er I’ll, I’ll go get my royalty check from Jaber afterwards. There you go. We gotta talk to those guys, you know, but we’ve used, you know, we’ve used this uh rocket system, rocket estimating system and um you know what we like about this is that it also, it’s AC RM I, it’s a full system. And so right now as we speak, uh I have a dolphin and Kevin downstairs. Uh probably we’ve done two or maybe three or four estimates out of it.

And so we have been the last couple of weeks, I think we only started this like about 3 to 4 weeks ago. Uh We had a, a one on one training with uh uh with one of the consultants. Uh And so we really like it. I really think that this is really gonna work. It’s gonna work for us for, for the CRM part. Um, it, it can, um, connect to our Quickbooks. Um, we can invoice from there. We can turn our estimate into a work, uh, a work order.

Um, there’s so many different things that I think are gonna work. Um, we still have to adjust some of those things and do some manually because of the type of job. But this is gonna give us a very good base for what we’re looking for. When did you guys implement this? Uh I would say about three weeks ago. Ok. So you guys are using, you’re using job or send out the estimate, do the project management manager, your customers because it’s, you’re using it as AC RM. You’re basically living inside of it right now.

Uh We have been today is our office day. So we have all six members of the office in here, uh breaking the, putting the brains together and putting all the information like we have all, all of our clients. So we’re assigning the clients to there. Uh So in the future, this is gonna give us, uh, reminders is gonna, we’re gonna have updates. So, um it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s a lot of work at the front end. But I think that once you get that going, it’s gonna make our life so much easier.

And actually being able to have Kevin, which is one of our youngest, uh guys here in the, in the office to a chance to be able to estimate, you know, and so we can’t, we haven’t been able to find an estimator. So we actually creating one. Yeah. Right. Let’s back up for it. So kind of dive in, but let’s sort of back up from the decision for a second just to lay a framework for this. So I, I, I’m gonna kind of dive into specific things, you know, as, as you’ve, you’ve been doing this for a really long time and people who are listening, who are maybe considering transitions, they can think about how you approached it.

When you’re looking, you, I know you’ve tried Estimate Rocket sounds like you’ve tried quite a few. What advice would you give to somebody if they’re, they’re looking to transition CRM? Um You know, they want to expose how, what, what kind of mindset did you go into it with? What should they be? Because their company obviously might be very different from yours. But the approach can be similar. What recommendation would you have for them? Well, um I’ve had, I’ve had this actually conversation with quite a few guys and um most of the, the, the, the people that we speak to, the, the painters that we speak to are either on that transition or they’re just barely getting started.

So uh more than one thing that I can always recommend that we did not do in the past is, is document things, you know, data. That’s, I mean, you know, you listen to Nick Slavic and, you know, your dad is your baby. You know, it’s, it’s everything that, you know, so every time you uh does he, does that guy care about data data quite a bit. I, I, he, I thought he’s just about feelings. I thought it’s just data or feelings and nothing else. Right. You know, I think, I think the data was, was way back then.

That’s data is so deep now that the true feelings are coming out. That’s what I, that’s my take. Yeah. Now the feelings are being laid on top. Yeah. Yeah, I know we love Nick man. I’ve learned so much from this guy. Um but I’m like a scientist with it. I’m, I, I sometimes I wonder like, how is that possible? I’m just wondering, I respect that. Um It’s not human man, he’s not human, it’s, it’s just more than human. Um But um basically one thing that you have to do before you get into any of these systems is you, you, you, you have to have your data, like you have to uh make sure that you make a purpose of creating like let’s say you have a standard how the door is gonna be done, have a standard for that and write it on a paper, write it wherever you need to because all that information, it has to go into one of these programs in order for it to work.

So you’re basically, you’re creating sops essentially, right? Like documenting this. So it can be repeatable and it can be taught to somebody else or, or someone else. Well, our, our mistake was when we first got our 1st 1st estimated program was that, um we didn’t really have a lot of data to go from, you know, we didn’t have like we couldn’t pull out our computer and say, OK, based on our history, like it takes us this amount of time or we can down into like uh square feet, we didn’t have any of that.

So we were paying for a program that we couldn’t use. They do have this very generic, generic, um pricing and stuff, but it doesn’t apply to most of us. Um And so you wanna tweak that and wanna make that yours, but in order to do that, you have to have that information. So for us in the beginning, we couldn’t because we didn’t have that information. So then after that, what we did is we said, OK, from now on, we’re gonna take our time and we’re gonna, we’re gonna document everything that we do and then when we’re ready and find the right program, now, now we put in, put in all this information into it and that’s what we’re doing for our system right now.

Um CRM, I think is a whole different story. Uh CRM, I think we should honestly, you should get one of those things the minute you start your business, you know, uh, you have to have a record of your clients, you have to be able to communicate with them. And for us for, I don’t know, 15 years we’ve done it all the old school way and now that, um, I think we’ve been exposed for quite some time but, um, our volume of clients is not as big as some of some of them who does repaints and small repaints for them.

It’s gonna be extremely ex you know, hard to communicate with their clients for us. You know, we can be in a client’s home for over a year. So communication is kind of simple. Um But now having AC RM is like, it has, it gives you the reminders. Um um you can do just basically sketch or whatever you want. So it’s not just in your head, it’s like when you put your calendar on your phone, you know, that’s kind of like the same thing for your business. The CRM for you is basically not as, it’s very, very helpful, but it’s not even as mandatory as it would be for some of these companies that, that typically are servicing much smaller ticket value, smaller sales prices and higher volume because there’s no way to effectively, I mean, you’re managing relationships, you know, small volume, very, very high ticket value.

These are personal, one on one relationships. You don’t really need to be sending out automated texts or emails or, or have this, this CRM because you, you can’t keep everyone possibly straight. But as a, as a smaller painting company owner, you know, I think one of the mistakes that a lot of them make is they’ll start to, to kind of do projects and do projects and they’re just looking for projects, but they’re not really documenting or, or maintaining anything. So there’s no referrals. There’s no, there’s no rhyme or reason really to what’s happening until way down the line.

But at that point, you, you’ve given up really a treasure trove of business because even your leads that didn’t convert, they might not have converted for anyone. So if you have some, some ability to continue to communicate with them, you’re likely to close some not insignificant percentage of them over time. And one of the, oh, sorry Juan, you got my, you got my mind racing, man. Go ahead. Go ahead. That’s what I wanted to see. And you said, I, I think it was genius and I think it’s, it’s so often overlooked because we see these, you know, we’re in all these Facebook groups, right on in all these communities.

What CRM do you use? What CRM do you use? Um But the, the thing that I, I never really see that much is what do I need to do at my company to actually make the CRM as effective as possible. And as you said, they’re gonna essentially have a, a template for, you know, like a default but depending on the CRM, as long as it is, you know, one that’s maybe a little bit more robust. A drip job is obviously tailored specific to painting companies. Job is, is a great one.

But you can go in and you have the ability to customize, but you can’t customize what, what you don’t know. So then you go in, you’re basically running someone else’s painting company because you don’t know your numbers that, that I, you couldn’t, if that’s correct. That’s, that’s completely right. But let me back up a little bit to where you said about how, like it, well, we may not need it but it’s so important when you want to be more efficient because, um, you know, then now if you can, I mean, we’re just barely getting started with this program.

I know that we’re gonna go through it and, uh, we have to, you know, we tend to exactly the learning curve. But, um, but we really like it and I think based on, on our business because you have to base that. I mean, our services, you have to find something that’s gonna work with you. Not, I mean, there’s some great systems out there but they may not so friend, they may not be so friendly with what you’re looking to do for us. You know, I think that’s something that we’ve been over looking and overseeing is the maintenance part of our, of our business, you know, uh we’re, we’re, we’re creating um uh divisions in our, in, in our business and I think the maintenance part of it, we have overlooked it and because we don’t have a consistency because we may have, you know, maybe a sheet or a, a list of clients, but having AC RM is gonna give us reminders, it can send an automatic email.

It just, you, you stay, like you said, you can stay in front of, in front of your client for us doing that, you know, that creates a whole different uh revenue from our business than to be looking for new clients. But it’s, we don’t need to have someone doing it. It’s our own system that is keeping us updated and all it takes us in the beginning is to upload all their information and upload all these uh you know, uh schedules or whatever you need to have in the future.

So that is very convenient. That’s something that we have overlooked for quite some time and it just, we weren’t ready. You know, sometimes you have to be ready to do these moves because if you’re not ready, you, you have to put the time and you have the time has to come from somewhere. And so that’s very important to know anyone that wants to do it. Yeah, because you, you do have to, there’s gonna be a learning curve with stuff like this. You have to be willing to invest some time into it.

And I think that’s another mistake that can sometimes be made as people make the transition, but they expect it to be an easy button or they get very frustrated very quickly. You know, you, you have to just like anything, you know, just like any part of your business. You have to learn how to, to sell the paint, paint product. You have to learn how to estimate, you know, you have, you have to learn certain things you’re also gonna have to learn. So, you know, the CRM or whatever software you, whatever tools you’re going to use, you have to, to learn it or have someone on your team at least learn it and teach it to you. Yeah.

You know, it’s very true. And so with that there, there’s so much there, there’s so much to come in place, you know, um because of now that we’re the only one of the main reasons why we can implement these programs is because, um, you know, a few months back we started doing, um, well, first we defined um positions in our company. You know, we have a very good definition of based on your knowledge. This is where you stand and you know, in the company and this is your position.

And in order to, you know, to either get a better pay or get a different position, you gotta go, you gotta meet these standards once you meet these standards and I can, you can go up that, you know, that next step, um, by doing that. Um, now you have that very clear. So you, no one is fighting to do what, no, everybody knows based on their position, what they’re, um, you know, what they should be doing. Uh, then that brings you into what we’ve done is, um, constant meetings.

So we have meetings every Monday for our lead men, which are our foreman. And these, we talk about, uh, what the, uh, week looks like, um, what jobs we have coming up. And so we put all these together and, and that allows us to have time because we’re not running back and forth throughout the week. So it’s all these little things that lead to having the time to implement these programs. And so, and we’re only doing it this way because we’re doing it the opposite way. You know, most new, you know, companies should start the opposite way, the system, you know, your estimating system, your Cr MS and put all these systems in, in place first and then you, you will do it the right way for us.

You know, we have all these baggage for so many, many years that we have to undo these bad habits, turn them into a good, better habit and now, uh prepare for the future by implementing this because now we see that as we move along, we’re gonna have more time to do or be more efficient because these programs will help us do what we were doing, running around like a chicken without his head. You know, and I think there’s a, a very common occurrence with young entrepreneurs or young business owners with the kind of an early stage company and even with companies that I’ve been around for some time is, which is where people mistake activity for achievement.

You know, they’re doing a lot, they’re hustling, they’re calling, they’re, they’re, they’re, they’re going out there, man. They’re doing so much, they’re grinding, they’re, they’re growing the business that’s phenomenal, the work ethic, the focus, the sense of urgency is phenomenal. But if you can do less and you can be more efficient and effective, ultimately, you’re gonna run a company that’s worth running, that doesn’t destroy your life. And it’s also gonna provide you a, a much better financial opportunity moving forward. Less is more, man. You always hear that.

But it’s, it’s very true. And you know what, what you described, I’ve been through so many of those stages in, in, in our company uh from being uh you know, a, a young, you know, 20 in my young twenties to my thirties to get to a point where I just stopped by being busy, meaning that I’m moving forward. And um it, it took a long time, a very long time to actually get to this step where like you can actually sit down, you have to sit down and analyze things before you do them.

You know, you know, sort of, it makes sense to think about it. But you’re, you know, there, there’s that thing gnawing at you. Like, what are you doing? You gotta go, you gotta go hustle. But if you sit down, for example, the, the cr we’re talking about AC RM. Right. So, obviously I talk with a lot of painting company owners, a lot of the smaller ones. What do you do when a lead comes in? Well, I call them as soon as I see it, I call them, you know, then I send him a text if I haven’t heard back two hours later, I, I call him again and if I haven’t heard the next day, I’ll, I’ll call him again.

That feels productive. You know, it’s like, man, I, I’m all over it. Yeah, I’m chasing that lead down. Oftentimes those leads aren’t really closing for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is that it’s not a systematized business. But what if you just spend 100 and $50 a month on, on drip jobs or used job or used any variety of Cr MS, you learned how to set it up and all of a sudden all those things are happening and you didn’t do any of it and you didn’t, you didn’t have to have a mental bandwidth even more than the time or the energy.

The fact that you have to try to keep track of all this stuff is exhausting. That’s correct. And I think it has to come back to that mentality. You know, it goes real, go back to the mentality because 10 years ago, if you were to tell me about this, I’m like, you’re crazy, man. I’m busy, you know, like, dude, your mom had it figured out, man. I wish I could get him on here. That guy, right? What happened to that guy? I’m looking for that guy. Come on, I take a step and like, where are you, where are you?

You would know the answer to this if you were here. Dang it. Yeah, you would jump and then ask questions. You ask all these questions. Why my, my head hurts. I like weigh the pros and the cons and stuff now, man, I didn’t used to do that, you know, you jump first, ask later right now. We’re like um should I do it? Should I do it a little, a little more experienced little, you know, it, it makes a difference, it makes a difference, you know, I think um I think it’s just not just business but everything in life with the more experience we have in one specific department or whatever it is that we’re doing.

Um It, it, it makes you think before you act and once you do that, it really the, you know, the outcome is so much. Maybe, maybe it would have been the same outcome but you have more control of it than, than we don’t, then we just jump. Um, believe it or not, I’m, I’m still that person, I’m still get into more things than I should. Uh, but that’s just my nature. You know, I, I used to think that, um, I had a problem which I still do someone but I understand my, my character now and I understand that I am not someone who can have things that are just kind of lined up one in front of the other.

Um, I’m just a multitasker. I don’t know why. I just, I it’s not that I work better but I, I like to have different, I have to have my hand in different things. But the difference, the big, big difference is understanding that there are ways to help me do that in a more efficient way and that, that part is really important too. There is no set what you, what you described there is actually more similar to how most entrepreneurs are. We’re curious, we’re, we’re, we, we like to try different things.

You know, if we wanted to just put 103 ft in front of the other, we’d probably be working the job, you know, we probably wouldn’t want to run and lead a business and be able to try these new things. But you recognizing, hey, this is something that maybe at certain times in your life was not the most productive thing at that time, you know, maybe you stretch yourself thin but you, you recognizing that, you know, the self awareness, accepting it and saying, OK, how can I use it to help the company while acknowledging how it could potentially be detrimental if I just let it run while uh you know, it, it comes with the, in the, with the territory, right?

It just um you live and learn, you, you go into, uh, I mean, just this last couple of years, um, we had, we have had, I don’t think we had like big losses like we had in the past, but we’ve had a lot of expenses on trying to implement things and learn new ways and you try something, it may not work for your company, you scratch it and then you move on and find another one because, um, a lot of times I think that, um, uh, one of the, one of the things that we’re doing right now is we’re implementing different things like we are doing like from having our, our own warehouse to, you know, have our own material, like a large amount of material, you know, it helps us maintain more control of that and just everything that we do make changes, these are big changes, you know, and believe it or not, when you start making these changes, there’s more income coming into you and you’re, you’re being more efficient, you have things when you need them.

Um you have an inventory, you, I mean this structure but you know what you never end and like it always keeps changing, it keeps evolving and you have to understand that that’s, that’s the name of the game. You know, five years ago, we were implementing, you know, things of like how we were gonna go and undo 12, 15 years to now, we’re like everything that we’re implementing now is like, OK, how are these decisions in these programs are going to make our lives so much easier and be more profitable in the next 10 years?

So it’s, it moved from thinking in the past and now we’re thinking forward. So and, and so that’s I i it’s just those things that I guess change in yourself and in your business and every change you make is gonna direct you to the new to the next one and you gotta be able to recognize that and your point about how it’s never going to stop, you know, is a really big one. I know one thing I’ve struggled with in the past is just wanting to be there.

You know, what’s the destination, but you, you will never get there. Something I had to work through and accept, especially as an entrepreneur. There is no there, you know, you’re on, you’re on a road, the road can be kind of rough at times, the road can be awesome at times you hope that the road consistently overall gets better. That’s the goal that it, it’s trending upward, but it’s a road and you keep going and you’re gonna make mistakes, but they’re actually not really mistakes. So counterintuitively, you said you try things, they don’t work.

If you never try. If you look at your business, you say, what are the, what are the initiatives? I’ve tried over the past year, past two years, heck past five years. What are the, what are the big ones? I’ve tried that didn’t work. If you’re having a difficult time coming up with answers to failed initiatives, it means you certainly don’t try enough things. That is very true. And if you don’t try, man, you’re, you’re never gonna, you’re never gonna find out. Yeah, that’s the thing, how breakthroughs happen.

That’s right. And honestly sometimes, um you prepare yourself for certain things and then you, you have a vision and uh you know, we use this ana ana analogy a lot about the gps, right? So we put on a destination and uh we got to get there. That’s, that’s our destination. But the problem is that in the middle of getting there, there could be road work, there could be an accident. So you’re gonna take all these, you know, detours and stuff, but your mission is to get there.

And that’s basic, that’s basically what this is, you know, um you gotta be open minded about this. I understand that things are not gonna work. The way you want them sometimes as much as you want them to and if they do, they’re, they’re most likely gonna be harmful for you and your company. So, um, it’s very good to keep that in mind, I think. Yeah, 25000%. Yeah. And, and the path, you know, the fact that things are not oftentimes not gonna go exactly how you want them. I mean, that’s, that’s the name of the game.

I rarely, I can’t think of many times that they have, you know, and even if they even things that have gone really well, it wasn’t even how I thought it was going to go, it just went a lot better. It’s almost never how I think it’s gonna go. It’s either worse or better. Ra very rarely am I like, I’m gonna do this for six months and this is exactly what’s gonna happen. Oh, there it is. You know, it’s a journey, it’s an adventure that we’re on that.

That’s right. So all we need to, I guess what we’re doing now is we’re incorporating systems and, and, and, and people and, uh, and, and just mindsets together to get to that destination, you know. Um I think right now illusions is in a, is in a great position because um like we feel that we, we’ve been working for the last few years on creating a platform to allow us to grow, you know, and uh by understanding that we have key positions in our company that and we want those key positions to grow with us as well and to have to earn more than just a salary in the future.

Um that will allow us to get there. And I think for them to be a big part and to see what illusions is doing right now, it’s really helping and really moving this a lot faster than I thought it would go. What do you mean the, the platform for growth? What did you do to create a platform for growth? Uh Well, first of all, uh we go back and start talking about like having more data, right? For us, uh having standards um creating a team that is not just about like, how much are you gonna pay me a team that really understands that we want to be, we have a goal on in, in, in the business and they share that, you know, I think that’s very, very important because you can create all these systems and you can be the most efficient person.

But if your team does not share the same vision with you, they’re not gonna, they’re not gonna go to battle with you, you know, and, and, and it’s, and I said something there that it says with you, like you gotta be there with them. They gotta, they gotta feel that this is just as important for you there. It is to them because it uh I’ve seen many companies where they just like, um, you know, it’s like, it’s, it is a business but we see it more as a family.

Like I love these guys. I wanna make sure that these guys have a place to go. Well, actually this is funny because before I feel that I, my thing was like, I just wanna make sure I have a place for my painters to go, you know, on Monday or the next day or, or so on, right? I think that it’s changed it to where like now I feel that I want to create a path for anyone in the company that wants to, you know, grow in many different ways that our company can provide, that I want to give that to that person.

And when I find that person, it’s gonna work for both of us because I am at the end gonna have that growth for the for the business. But he has a vision where he can say, you know, what if I stay here? Five years, six years, this is what I’m gonna be doing. I’m gonna be taking care of my family based on what this company is providing for me. So I guess those are the platforms other than the systems and everything is it is you have to do that for me.

I think in, in California especially we can’t do sub you know, subcontracting, so you have to have so your guys are gonna be key. So for the growth of your company. I think we oversee. That is one of the biggest parts. You agree. Yeah. And the with you part, right? Like they’re not, they’re not there to serve you. If anything, you’re actually there to serve them. One of the, one of the ways that I really like thinking about it or that’s been explained to me, it really resonated with me and, and that I try to implement is you serve your team so that your team can serve your customers.

And that’s the dynamic, the team’s not there to serve you. You’re not a king on a throne, you’re there to serve them, support them, empower them, train them, you know, inspire them and then they’re there to knock it absolutely out of the park for your end customers and, you know, and, and, um, and it’s so easy to promise your team and, and, and say, hey, this is what I’m gonna do for you. But another one is really, you know, walk the walk, you know, um we, we do six month uh reviews and in those six months, we want to make sure that, um, you know, uh we qualify you on whether you met expectations did not meet expectations or exceeded expectations, you know, and we want our guys to exceed expectations.

And so when they see that, that we’re sitting down and uh I mean, the majority of them, they exceeded expectations. So now guess what, I’m gonna move you up to the next step and they’re happy because they accomplished something. You know, we write, we write a small goal, what we wanna do improve, you know, in us in the next six months. And, and when we look at that goal that they had, and I’m like I asked them like, what do you think? You know, how do you think you’ve done?

Like, uh, well, I think I’ve done good. I’m like, you’ve done excellent. You know, it, it just gives them this reassurance and, and stuff. From our part, we talk about how are we setting our business for, for growth is, um as I mentioned, uh our niche is, is high end homes, very expensive homes, long jobs, I mean, extremely like they’re not as I think we will be more profitable in a repaint system than when we are here, but this will give us work for many years, secure jobs.

So it, it’s a give and take. But so we understand that in that area, we’re gonna get a cap. And so what we’ve been doing is we want to create divisions to our company to where now our, our shop is growing. So that’s our next step that has been growing. Um So that’s gonna be a completely different new show. Uh It is now a different division of the company and we treat it that way because we wanna have, we wanna separate that completely from. I don’t wanna have my guys who do high end residential, you know, finishing cabinet.

So we wanna have a finisher in the shop. So creating that um we have a couple other divisions. We are soon enough gonna run very deep into the repainting business. Uh But for that, we wanna have this um systems running to where I can have a couple of um um estimators and based on the, based on everything that we’ve done, based on the, the reputation that illusions uh has created, we feel that we do very good in that department. Um I want to dive into that, but I wanna, I wanna ask, I think two questions first about, about some of the stuff you just covered.

So people who share your vision, you guys are building it together. How do you find people who share that vision? Do you have you refined your interview process or, or what’s the approach there? So, I mean, things have, you know, a couple of things have changed. Um our hiring process, you know, most painters I think throughout the us are gonna agree with me that sometimes the way we used to hire someone will be like you should be referred by someone. They’ll be like, they’ll call you and say, hey, this person told me you need someone or I will call someone and say, hey, I’m looking for someone and they come to you, whether you have an office or they’ll come to you wherever you briefly, just kind of talk to him and say how you doing?

I’m so, and so what kind of experience you have? I will be like, you’re higher, you know, come by Monday. You know, that’s usually, that’s how it used to be for us. See how it goes. Yeah. Right. See how it goes. I’ll give you, I used to be like, let’s try it for two weeks and then we move on, but it’s just, it’s, uh, I don’t even wanna get into that point. Now, what we do is we have, we are gonna interview three times, you know. So first of all, um, I’ve learned this from many guys, uh that they have to follow directions.

So someone that wants to work with you has to follow directions. Um So we either can have someone apply online on our website. We have indeed. Um, there’s a couple other ways, but basically you can apply to their, send us your, you know, your resume. Um, you can apply, you can come into the office and fill out an application. Um We’ll kind of review the applications and if we see what we, you know, if we see anything or anyone kind of stands out, then we’ll be like, we’ll reach out to them, we’ll reach out to the other one.

Say, hey, you know, we’re not hiring right now, but, you know, in the future we’ll have your information. Um, but if we like someone they’re like, ok, you know, I, I like what you have here. Let’s set up at times to come in, into the office. They come in and they usually, um, interview by our office assistants, which is Patty and Isabel. And it’s, um, basically they’re gonna ask very, like, generic questions of where you worked, uh, you know, just to check out the character of the person, you know, and then, uh, Patty will, you know, then relate that information to us and be like, oh, hey, um I like this guy, you know, or I don’t like this guy or I like what he has and um and then from there, we’ll catch another uh another uh appointment, another interview.

And that is then either with me or Jose, you know, or our, with our project manager. So now we’re talking about like, again, we’re getting more in depth of like, look, you know, just ask general questions. We wanna know your character at that point, what you kind of know, but what kind of character you have, you know, we, we hire more character than, than, you know, than skills here. I can teach you how to be a painter, but I cannot teach you how to be a good person or follow directions, you know.

So that has changed a lot. So I think that really changes once you, because you’re definitely gonna do when you’re gonna hire someone, it’s, you’ve gone through these couple layers and and I think that’s very important and most of the painters, at least that I know personally we didn’t do that, you know, and that’s why your return is so quick. Yeah. Yeah, the hiring, the hiring process is critical, having the right team members. And then I think to, to add on to that, having a hiring funnel, like you said, sometimes, you know, you’ll take their information and say, ok, we’re not hiring now.

And I know in that instance you indicated because you didn’t like them. But you can also be interviewing when you’re actually not hiring right now. And it should be a recurring activity because then when you need to hire people, what you don’t want is, oh my gosh, I need somebody. Ok, let’s get a warm body through the door. You should already have a list like a short list of applicants. Reach out to them. Hey, you know what a spot just opened up? Are you still? You’re not?

Ok, no problem. You know, when, if you end up freeing up, please reach back out on to number two. But you’ve been doing that and you already, there’s no employment crisis for you because it’s an ongoing activity for your business because you anticipate growth that, you know, that, that is exactly true. I, I’ve heard this from a coach, uh, you know, the, one of the expos a couple years ago and he said that you should always be recruiting. You’re not always hiring, I should always be recruiting and, and like marketing or sales.

It, it’s a, it’s another sale. It’s another marketing and sale. That’s your business. It’s already there on the back burn, uh, back burner. Like you, you, you know, you’re constantly seeing someone even if you, if you’re not hiring. But, you know, we hiring and, and labor right now in these days, in any place is just extremely tough as you may know. You know, and so that it’s great. But I think another thing that we’ve done to create that is um one thing that I think that we’ve learned as well through the PC A was to create value for a painter to wanna come for you and work for you.

You know, because there are many guys out there, many painters out there who maybe work for a painting contractor or they’re doing something that it’s like, you know, the pay is good but, you know, they may not get, they don’t have good standards. Uh The person doesn’t know what he’s doing. You’re constantly like, you know, losing your mind and there’s so many things that can go wrong, right? But when you create a business that you see that it runs well, you see that everybody’s talking about it, you, you see that they’re working in these nicer homes or doing this work.

Um We really advocate on um training. So we actually take the time to get our guys away from the job and train them. Um we would uh reach out to all the manufacturers that we work for and they’ll come in and do demonstrations and, and you know, like how hands on how to do something. So we wanna attract those painters, those guys that, you know, guys, girls, we wanna track them. And so when you do these things, it, it’s, it’s, it’s in on purpose, you know, because you are attracting these guys, the guys who are more about like how much they’re getting paid, they’re not gonna end up here because they don’t see the value that we’re providing.

So that’s another big part of it too. Building your company to, to attract the right people. That’s correct. Yeah. So I, I wanna, I wanna touch on one thing real quickly and then I wanna dive into your divisions and you’re playing for the future and you can, this is a, a supposition that I’m making based on your previous episodes because I, I was wondering, OK, if you treat if you, if you view your team as a family, how do you get rid of a family member? Right?

How do you say like, OK, you’re not cutting it, but then I remember that you, you guys specify, you have very strict, not strict, you have very defined KPIS, you have very defined expectations and you do these six month reviews. So you never let go of anybody. They basically let go of themselves. That’s correct. And that’s a beautiful system because that the, the whole, well, this is a business. It’s not a family you need to perform. That’s true. Technically. But if you actually have a, a clear, like you said, a, a company that has its act together a clearly defined process with clear expectations.

And hey, here’s what you have to do to, you know, to succeed in this role. Well, then you can, you can think of it a little bit like a family because the accountability is built into the system. That is true. You know, I think the whole, the, the way we imagine this to work and, and somehow thank God it’s working um is, is, is, it’s for that reason, we’re not, we’re not giving you or not taking anything from you. We’re giving you the chance, the opportunity and the tools to do what you would like to do and the training and everything you’re empowering. Exactly.

It’s completely up to you whether you want to do it or not, you know. Um the way it, I, I think firing someone is one of the toughest stuff thing to do. I, I’ve done it in the past. I don’t do it much. Someone else does. It’s a hard thing to do if you could say, oh, I, I inspired like somebody next to me every single day, then you’re, you’re one impressive person, you know. And so, um basically, um we have our defined positions in the company, you know, and if you wanna succeed and make more money, you just follow these steps.

And every six months we sit down and it doesn’t have to be six months. You know, it just, it might take more, it might take less depending on the position. But it, it, I have, uh, these are the road map, I’ll lay it out for you. You decide whether you go or not, you know, and we give them all the tools like we got the training. So whenever we do training, it goes into our, uh, into our website. And so they can actually see, uh, the trainings there on the website.

We actually track who actually gets on, on there and sees it so we can actually see that. Um, but we also have, uh, you know, our, I don’t know, we’re gonna change it but it’s a write up system, you know, very simple, straightforward write up system. We, we have the expectation of that for my family. If my brother-in-law acts up and I write him up, I write him, I just kick his butt. But no, that’s good. And you know what? I didn’t think of that. I should.

No, you know what I’m gonna, I’m gonna fire a bad joke. You were, you were on probation? Oh, I think I’m gonna, I’m, I’m gonna need a lot of arthritis. Really? No. But you know what? But you gotta take him serious. Like, I work in work. Um, I think there’s very few times I’ve done this and we actually had to fire someone on the grounds of being late. And for me in the past, I’m like, you’re late. Ok? You’re good. So I’m gonna, you know, let it pass.

You know, it’s, there’s always some, there’s gotta be something, you know, it’s not like I’m, I mean, someone perfect but I, but I guess it came down to the point of like, look, these standards live here for a reason. These rules live for a reason and we gotta obey by them the minute I allow you to break those, I’m, I’m hurting us, I’m hurting you and I’m hurting the whole team. And so it got to the point where like, you know, we talk to a person, we talk and we talked to a person for 260 times, you know, um, didn’t resolve, ok?

You know what, go to the office and sit down, you know, admin and I mean, um hr and they’ll give you a little write up saying that um your obligation is to be on time and so on and so on and you sign that, ok? Ok. If we give you another opportunity, if you don’t, you know, if you have a second write up, ok, go to the office again. But, but if you’re coming here to the office for the third time and it’s for the same reason.

Um, you’re not following directions. You really don’t, don’t take us serious, our comp, you know, take our company serious. You, you know, it’s just, there’s so many things there, uh personal and feelings, but you put this aside and you put a paper, you know, what, look we want you to be here. But unfortunately, you cannot follow these simple little steps. So for that reason, we would like you to just not constant, you know, terminate you. And it’s hard, it is very hard to do that. But I, I guess it really creates that the, the culture of like saying, hey, you know, I’m here for you.

But if you don’t follow those things, then, you know, then we’re gonna have to part with that view that’s viewed as fair too, you know, because you, you have all your other team members who are still there. And so if you let someone go and, and it doesn’t look like, you know, you are maybe trying to help that person before you let them go, you’ve created a potentially a negative ripple effect. Now with the remaining team members, I think so. But at, but at the end of the day, you know, we make it, we still work with people and we work with them quite a bit, you know, I guess we have like different um like, what do you say?

Like little, little, what was the word I was thinking for or different sections? Right? Let me kind of rephrase that, let’s say something happens at the job site, right? And it’s, uh and at the job site you have your painters, you have your pres and then you have your foreman. So if anything happens there, it’s kind of like we leave it up to the, just like anyone else, we leave it up to the, to the um the four men. Can he take care of this issue? Can he, you know, talk to whoever and then just make it go away?

If you can do that, then it stays at the job site. Perfect. So let’s say that person was, you know, was late, maybe once or twice. I’m like, hey, you know, talk to him, we can see it in the office, you know, we can see what time you clock in, what time you get there. And we also have another system, it’s called crew up just now that we started for our clock in awesome system too. Um But, um, if you can take care of that and they understand where you’re coming from and you can eliminate that, then that’s all it’s gonna take, we don’t need to write you up for everything or, or show our dominant, none of that, you know, OK, if that doesn’t pass, then how it’s gonna go into the project manager.

So now the project manager might say, hey, you know what, let’s, let’s talk about this. Let’s try to solve this issue. But then if it passes that, then, then it goes to our office, then if it’s not ok into our office, then it goes on to me or Jose. And if it gets to our point, we’re like, we’re doing something wrong. You know, this should have been taken care way before this step. And so I guess those are the, those are the little things that really, really set the tone for the company.

And one thing too, you know, when you set these expectations, you as the owner, really establish the culture. So for example, if, if, if being on time is important that that should just be, that should be part of your company culture. You can’t show up to estimates late projects late like that. I can’t think of a company that that’s ok. But so if you are naturally a tardy person, if you struggle with being on time and you’re the owner or you’re a manager of some kind, you need to alter prioritize that because you cannot expect your team to abide by the rules if you flagrantly don’t, now, if you’re the owner, it doesn’t mean you need to be there at 21000 a.m.

every day. If that’s not your work schedule, that’s fine. But if you have a meeting, you better be a couple of minutes early to that meeting, to demonstrate to people, it’s important to be on time to meetings. That is correct. You know, I’ve, I’ve heard this thing. And they say that the fish thinks from the head down. Right. Yeah. So it is, you know, the pressure is on us too. But I think that it, it, it has to be a reflection, you know, and whoever doesn’t, you’re not exempt, you’re not above, no, we’re not.

No, we’re not. We actually, we’re actually the ones that are in the fish bowl. Yes, that’s right. They say they say that about police officers, right? You have to live in a fish bowl because everyone’s a all of your actions. That’s what you as the owner are. That’s how we feel at home and that’s how we feel at work, right? So, yeah, I can, we can relate. I’ll, I’ll leave that one be Juan but I hear you. Good men smart, I’ll let, let that one sit. Um But hey man, we’re so we’re getting close.

I, I want to cover your future plans. I know you have big ones. I wanna, I wanna quickly touch on, you know, the divisions. You mentioned the maintenance division uh kind of building this out and you said, OK, I think you’re around 230 million, right? So I know you said you’re going to 210. Uh that’s our goal, you know, talk about it. Um So basically right now, I think this, um this is the year that we’re finally getting to the point where we’re moving forward because the last two years, we’re kind of stuck at the same uh point and we just hit the plateau and just building, building.

Now, uh some of the things we did a couple of years ago are going in. So like us moving into our shop last month, uh was one of them. That was a, that was a big one because we had a shop but it was too small for us to grow, you know, or to be, you know, to make it um work. So now we moved into a bigger shop that can accommodate us growing and, and really going after the um uh the actual cabinet makers and, and doing more production.

So our shop, it’s now it’s part of like our office. It’s in um it’s about 212 minutes from there because it’s so expensive here in this area. So we have our office that is gonna, it takes care of the um of the whole business. But here we have a, a room downstairs where we’re gonna CRE where we’re creating a showroom. So what we want is we want to have, we have one to have a, an actual finishing shop where it’s, it’s, it’s a full system where like I work with designers.

So we’re gonna design the showroom to where I wanna bring the clients in. Uh any other girls or anyone in the office can sell any other products. Uh Can we’re gonna start from a standard finish from there, we can get creative and we work with. So many different like, you know, metal finishes, uh very high-end finishes, uh fine pain of Europe. So we do all those. Um and we really feel that by creating that whole system, I mean, the whole subdivision that is really gonna allow us to, to grow that to a couple million dollars, you know, we, we really see that um very visible and we have the clients, you know, we just didn’t have the right place and I, now I feel that we have the right place now, we feel that probably it’s gonna be the next, you know, four or five months, um uh getting the shop together, finishing up the showroom to really see it going, you know, and so our goal is by the end of the year to have this full division of the shop running and, you know, producing money. Yeah.

So that’s, uh you know, and, and that’s, that’s a big part right now. That’s what we’re really focusing on. Um, we have, uh, our other division is like the high end residential. Um We feel, I feel that what we lack, we don’t have enough help and we don’t, we don’t sell enough, well, we don’t have to sell because we cannot even get to half of the stuff that it comes our way. But I do wanna have a sales team or, you know, estimating team that are gonna have more consistent things and they’re just gonna be, you know, if we have a 103 months or two years ahead of us.

I wanna have five years ahead of us. And with these big homes, we can, you know, because we get, we, you know, we get plans for, for the jobs and, you know, if we get awarded for the job, they’re gonna start the job out in two years. By the time we get to that job, it’s probably three or four. So that’s how we know we have this much and, um, jobs, most of these stuff are time and material. So we’ve been working very, very hard to do job costing.

And so now it’s, that is allowing us to get to our sweet spot. Um, we really, we found out that we very, we were underbidding ourselves, you know, and so we, uh, all the value that we’re creating into the business now we’re putting it into there and with the system now we can have a clear, a clear vision of where we should be, what, what our rate should be. Yeah. Uh, we started doing restorations. Um, so we have some quite a few older homes here in the area, you know, lead, you know, before, you know, you know, like 210 fifties.

And so, uh, we didn’t get into those because of the whole lead and, and issue. So now we creating that the kind of like it’s not a division, but it’s, we’re really getting into those, those jobs now because we we understand the high end part of it. And now we trained our guys to work with materials we take in the training. Um We have incorporated, uh we bought a um time blasting system um about a year back and it goes back to it. This is already prepping for things we wanted to do.

So now we feel that um we can use, we can use this sand blaster and, and get it together with the restoration. And so that might be a whole new, that would be our other division, you know, sandblasting and restoring um sort of things. And, um, but we wanna create them separate so that I can actually hire a person, you know, I can hire someone that’s gonna run that division. And I’m not taking, you know, my guy from my residential to go do that or I’m not taking my guy from the shop to do that.

So that’s why creating that division. I think that is really, it’s gonna allow us to do that because now the cons the, the uh prosper is gonna be there because the consistency is gonna be there in the past. We couldn’t do that because if we get a person from a high end job and wanna do residential, you’re gonna, you’re gonna lose, you know, you’re gonna lose your money because they’re not trained to do residential or like repaints, you know. And so I think that that’s one of the things that we work in, that’s kind of like a, that’s, those are, um, there’s a couple more things that we’re working on like the, uh, we have, we do metal finishes.

Um, recently we started doing, uh, we, we hire someone who’s just a master at colors, you know, at, at matching colors and doing colors. So we have a friend that, um, that does flooring. So we’ve been doing finishes for floors and so that’s another possibility. So that’s how we feel that we can grow our business because we’re gonna be a very well rounded business, but we’ll have different divisions so that not everybody is jumping into each other, you know, and horizontally here you’re seeing the, the, um, I guess the advantages that you have, you know, the relationships with these high end homeowners that you have and how can you monetize it through additional channels and how can you utilize the skill set, the team, the resources that you have to, to open up other divisions?

And, uh, our, our main division, I think it’s really gonna pay. What does that do? Exactly. So, most of these homes, you know, um, they’re, you know, 229 to 229,000 square feet homes, they’re out on the water, they’re out on the extreme heat and they’re all, you know, everything is wood. Um, it, so basically every year or every year and a half, I can have someone there, um, doing a maintenance code on, on windows because what happens here is like, no one really has a system that, that is doing like maintenance.

So, what they do is most of these homeowners don’t live here. You know, they come here once, twice a year, uh, from all over the world and then, um, they come and they don’t pay attention to this. Win their windows because that’s not what that is important to them. So, but when 23 years later they go back and now the, now the finish has failed. Now we have to strip everything. So now they’re paying, you know, 60 $80,000 to refinish their windows as opposed to when you create a maintenance system where I can be there, you know, once a year and there’s only gonna be some areas, you know, the southern exposure is gonna have the, um, you know, it’s gonna have the heat, it’s gonna crack your windows, your finish and then your northern exposure is gonna have mildew and stuff.

So just by doing the maintenance, I can probably say I have my guys here for 40 hours and now your house is looking great, but we’re protecting the integrity of the house, you know, just um, so that’s how we are creating this. Uh And every time you’re there, there’s a new opportunity. Oh, yeah. You know what, why don’t you just paint this bedroom? Well, hey, I wanted to, we want to do this last season and so it just creates a whole new revenue from your clients. And I think something that we’ve learned here is that we wanted to go after new clients when, when in reality your existing clients, if they like you, I mean, you already trust factor is already there.

So if you can other ways, you know, you have built in recurring revenue, a nice recurring revenue stream with the maintenance, it’s, it’s your least expensive client to obtain is the one that you already have. That’s right. And, and that, and creating that, that bond, you know, um by you showing up to their house by you, you know, going six months and walking around and seeing those things. I think that’s where you bring the value. They’re like, oh my God, they actually care. Yeah. You know, and so, and so by those you get more different rules and everything too because you have a real relationship at that point, something deeper.

That’s correct. And so, um, I, I just had a conversation with someone, uh, couple weeks ago we went, we drove down to L A um for a um uh show and, um, they were giving me an example about how they use all these um lead systems, you know, like you buy the lead, you buy him and he’s talking about how he can sell, you know, 5000 and $50,000 in, in, in a month. And, but, you know, most of his average paint jobs are like, 3 to $5000. I’m like, man, like you gotta sell a lot in a month, you know.

And uh and our business is so different. I mean, it’s completely different. Uh uh an average job for us. A repaint power here is gonna be about 60 $1000 something like that on outside. Most. I think that our sweet spot and our high end residential will probably be a star of like a quarter, a quarter of a million. That’s just the start base for some of these homes. So, you know, but you, but you have to have this whole system to make it profitable. Most guys, what happens here with these homes?

A lot of people don’t like to work on them because what happens is they don’t have a, they don’t have a, they don’t have a system to go into these homes. What they do is they just work, work, work, work, work and they work for months and they realize that they, they didn’t pay attention to, you know, how much, how long they were working there, how long it’s taking you material at the end of the day. They don’t make any money. Yeah. And so for us, we had a, we had to really get the system down to.

We’re like, look guys, we’re here, but we’re working by sections. Ok? We got doors, ok. Let’s say we have 30 doors. We have five to, you know, maybe, probably, I think it’s like 10 to 12 hours per door, there’s 10 ft doors. So we have 10 hours per door. So now we have this many hours for this many doors besides everything in the house. You, you take everything and you do it small. So that’s how we are. And that’s what I meant by creating these subdivisions because you can focus on them directly on how they need to be focused on.

And I think that’s, that’s how I see it visible for us about it. And it goes back to knowing, knowing your data, you know, all that you have to understand your company, Juan. This is been been really, really awesome man. I appreciate you opening everything up, you know, should talking to us so much in depth and sharing it, you know, not, not, you know, that abundance mindset, you’re really willing to just talk about anything and everything with your company. Uh Is there anything else that you wanna add before we wrap up this episode where um we, we, we are a place where OK, let me rephrase this.

Look at the future. Not, not at the past. I think I if I can tell him that because like I mentioned to you earlier, few years back, I was think I was working on everything that we’ve done in the past. Now, everything that we’re doing today is, is how we’re preparing for the future. So that mindset really changed us because now you see things that you need to see as opposed to the other way, uh to focus more on the future, learn from the past, but really focus more on the focus on, focus on your future.

Uh We used to focus too much on the past and that’s why we couldn’t move forward. Yeah, thank you, man. Episode four or five, the next one, we will be diving into some pretty exciting stuff talking about your podcast, the PC A, all the different initiatives you’re working on and I am super excited for that one. I got the Spanish PC A coming up too. That’s gonna, it’s September, right? September, November 29 September 29th. So I kind of wanna go, you can go, I’m gonna get you to invite me, man.

Oh, I’m, you’re off. You’re officially invited on the podcast. Uh Juan, thank you. We’ll do the next one in Spanish. No, I’m just kidding. We will not do it. I have my pen. Yeah. Yeah. Right. So you won’t have to, you just, all right, Juan, I appreciate you, man. Thank you so much. My brother.

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