What is going on everybody. Welcome to the live Q and A with Jason Phillips from Phillips Home Improvements. We are going to be discussing his six turned seven because I I kind of strong armed him into doing a number seven episode series. People make Dream Businesses. It was that good. If you haven’t listened to the series, uh you’re, you’re messing up kind of on life because you need to listen to it. But at least you’re here. Uh Jason, welcome man. Welcome, Brandon. I’m ex man. I’m excited for a Q and A here today.

This is wonderful. Yeah, I’m pumped up, man. So the, as a quick recap, remember when you, when you come in the point of these Q and A s is really to get your questions answered. So if you listen to the podcast series and you didn’t know whether something that Jason said would really work with your company or in your area or we talked about something and you wish that we had gone deeper or addressed a certain thing that we didn’t. Now it’s your time. Now’s your chance, right?

Get the answer. Get the, get the question answered if you haven’t listened to it and you’re just like, hey, I saw this cool event, you know, I, I like Jase, I like brand. I want to see what they’re saying. Welcome. Uh And then ask any questions that come to mind as we’re kind of talking through this stuff. And as a quick recap, it was a 403 again turned seven episode series. Uh episode one was key one. Leadership um is the key one to escaping contractor prison. Episode two is key two to escaping contractor prison was your team.

And episode three, the key three was the system. So we took a deep dive in the leadership team systems. Episode four is market for growth. Uh Jason has quite a story of his growth actually two times basically that he that he supers scaled his business. Um So how, how did he market? How did he do that episode five is Dis Jason is a certified behavior human consultant. That, that wasn’t even close. No, that was a, that was a human behavior consultant. No, you you human behavior consultant.

Ok. Episode six was motivators how to get everyone excited and motivated to help your painting company grow and succeed. And then seven was killer sales process seven was what I pulled out of Jason because he would do these little, he would drop like, don’t get porch or hey, if they say if they don’t, if they basically say no to your estimate, you send a second estimator, you quote him a higher price and then you get him to say yes. So I was like, we’re gonna have to explore that, Jason.

Uh Well, let’s kind of recap, man. Let’s, let’s talk a little bit as people come in. Uh If you can, if you’re listening, if you can just do a a hashtag live, that would be great. If you are, are listening later, we do record this stuff and distribute it. Um You can just do a hashtag recording in the chat. Jason. Where do you want to get started? Well, we could start with a recap of, of the episodes in order if you, if you like Brandon, let’s hit it, man.

You know who here wants to be a one man show for the rest of your career, raise your head or thumb, thumbs up right. There are a few there are a few but most people, most people don’t wanna do that. Most people want to build their business, the, the ones that I talked to wanna build their business and they want to, um, uh, evade or escape contractor prison. And you know what the contractor prison is? That’s, that’s when we’re, uh, that’s when we’re slaves to our business.

And we, we can’t get away from the cell phone. We’re the, we’re the firefighter constantly. We’re the problem solver constantly. Heck, maybe we’re doing all the sales or all the project management. Maybe we’re even doing, you know, some of the, some of the painting. But uh that’s why leadership is important. If, if you want to, if you want to grow your business and grow it the right way. And again, I’ve done this the wrong way and I’ve done this the right way. Then, then growing as a leader is absolutely important.

And that’s just, I mean, the man that just starts internally with a, with a uh personal, personal growth is just, is huge. Yeah. Yeah. Personal growth growing as a leader, uh you have to essentially change who you are. What got you here won’t get you there kind of thing. The hustle the street smarts, the, the determination will get your business started, it will get it off the ground. It’s not gonna create an amazing team. It’s not gonna scale your company 100%. You know, if, if we, if OK, what are some things that, what are some things that great leaders do?

For instance, they start with, uh they start with a great, well, let’s back up even a little more. Let’s, let’s not talk about what they do. Let’s talk about who they are. Great leaders. Um There have been some impactful leaders that weren’t great leaders. OK. So I’m gonna start there. Great leaders are people of intense integrity. There are people that operate out of principles. I’m not saying they’re perfect people but, but they’re people of character, they’re people of integrity. Uh Typically they’re, they’re people of transparency because if you’re not that you’re probably not going to get people to follow you for very long.

So you have to be a person of integrity and, and most of the time, people of passion, you’re passionate about a cause and, and you craft a vision. So if you think about this, you know, hey, I’ve, I’ve, I’ve got my business, I wanna grow my business and other people are going Yeah. So what, why, why do I wanna, what, what’s so good about your company? Yeah. So what’s in it for me? Kind of kind of Yeah. So what, so what’s in it for me? And, and when you get to the point where people stop necessarily asking just what’s in it for me when you have a vision that’s so strong that people say, what can I give to contribute?

Wow. Now you’re on to something at a whole new level, you know, at a base level, people are like, hey, I need a good job. I want a good paycheck and I want opportunity. That’s what’s in it for me. Then further is, hey, I want to use my skills and I wanna add value. But then you get to this other, this other level of, of, wow, this company is doing something really important and amazing. And this aligns with my values and my life goals. I want to be a part of that company.

Uh That’s where I want to invest my life in. And so that’s when, when you can get to that point, you’re gonna, you’re gonna have people’s hearts and I say that you can, you know, you can buy people’s hands with a paycheck, but you have to earn their hearts. You have to be a person of integrity. Of course, you have to be uh an empathetic leader as well. There’s just, there’s so much that goes into it, but it really just starts by, by, by being a good ethical person.

But, but now you get to craft a vision of the future, you know, where are you going as, you know, uh in the future? Let’s pretend for a moment. I’m, I’m gonna be uh uh I’m gonna, I’m gonna be the business owner and the potential employee for just a second. Um Hey, I, hey, I wanna grow my company. Oh OK. Uh great. Well, what, what’s in it for me? Well, hey, uh you wanna come, uh you wanna come be a painter or you wanna come sell for me?

So that conversation that banter, you know, goes, you know, uh back and forth. Obviously it’s more sophisticated than that. Right? But, but people, people want to, they want, they want to do work that’s meaningful, the right. People do. Some people, some people wanna, don’t wanna, don’t wanna connect with the job and, and they wanna live their life, passions. Uh Not that living your life’s passion is bad. I’m gonna make, I’m gonna back up for a minute, but they’re gonna use it as a means to an end like they have and some people aren’t interested in a career.

Some people literally, they just want to go to work and get a paycheck and, and just go mess around and, and do what they want in the rest of their lives. But other people are like, hey, I’ve got skills, I wanna grow, I wanna give and I wanna be a part of something that’s greater than me. Those are the people, those are probably the people that you want, right? So what are you doing as a, as a, as a painting company, as an owner? What are you doing in, in some way?

You know, your vision needs to encompass this concept that in some way you’re making the world a better place, maybe just in your community, your city, your zip codes, whatever, but you’re making the world a better place and somehow that needs to include you’re making uh life better for the families of your teammates and potential teammates. Yeah. And I think that trend toward meaningful work and that resonating and really being a requirement of, of people has, has been kind of a generational shift. And I think it, it’s become really much more mainstream than it used to be like before.

It was kind of a nice to have like, wow, that’s really, that’s really neat that your company is something that uh provides a lot of meaning. You know, my companies just work. I think it, it’s kind of shifted to being really a requirement if you want a powerful workforce and a team and some people that are really motivated. I think it’s a requirement. I don’t really believe it’s a nice to have at this point. You know, 11 of the things I, I totally agree with you, one of the things that, that as you start, you know, we’re going to attract who we are and as we start um articulating verbalizing our core values and our beliefs, as a business owner and as, and as a business, we’re going to start attracting, you know, our, our um one of our values is people and, and guess what, that, that’s out there in our job listings that we value people.

And so people that uh you know, are interviewing us. Hey, what it, what, what intrigues you about this position with our company? Well, I value people and I wanna work for a team that values people. They’re echoing this back to me. Not just because they have the right answers. They wanna have the right answers to get hired, but because they read, they, they read what we put and it resonated with them. You know, sometimes I’ll, you know, we’ll say it that way. Hey, what resonated with you about this position?

And uh some, so many times here’s we, we hear words like um ethics, integrity, transparency. And if you, if you think about who are you as a leader and practically boots on the ground when you’re working with your people, what are they, what are they seeing? Are they seeing someone who consistently makes decisions and lives their life and operates their business consistently in line with the core values or not? Yeah. Hey, Josh, Josh says hello. Hey Sony, great comments. Um Jason Phillips is the man. So super excited to have you guys here.

Um 100% 100% agree. Jason, one of the, one of the most powerful questions that I’ve found when hiring people is what are you, what are you looking for? Like, what would make this a tremendous experience for you? And I used to think back when I was would apply for jobs, you know, I’ve been an entrepreneur for some time, but uh when people would ask, like, like, what do you want out of this position or what are you hoping to achieve? I always kind of thought it was like a trick like a trap or like, there’s, there’s a certain answer that I’m supposed to give.

They’re trying to turn the table, you know, whatever, right? Some sort of Jedi mind trick. And now I realize the powerful, um, like, I realize it, it’s really the most important question of any of the questions because if, if what we have to offer is not perfectly synced with what they want, then one or both parties are going to be unhappy and it’s not gonna be the best scenario. But if you don’t have anything to offer except money, well, I, I’ll give you money, but that’s about what I had.

Well, then you, you’re a commodity as an employer because there are a lot of other people who are also willing to give money. And so as soon as someone else comes along and says, hey, I’ll give you more money. Well, then you lost that person and they probably weren’t nearly as productive as they could have been in the, in the interim. So how you approach sales for your customers? Like, are you just, you’re gonna put paint on the wall or if you’re just gonna put paint on the wall, then you better be the lowest price because otherwise I’m not gonna hire you.

It doesn’t make any sense, you’re providing the peace of mind that you always talk about the customer experience, you gotta sell your employees, you gotta sell your team members. What are you giving them? Wow, you’re man, you’re speaking, you’re speaking my language. I’m just, I’m copying you, man. You know, you charted the course. I’m following, man. You just, I’m just, you, you’ve got me, you’ve got me thinking and too many times ask yourselves, you guys that are, that are listening. What if when you’re interviewing someone and you’re face to face, interviewing them or, or whatever?

Are you trying to sell them on why they should come work for you? Are they trying to sell you or are you really trying to uncover if it’s a really good match? Does that make sense? And if we’re not careful, if, if you really need to fill that position, fill that position, you’re gonna just, you’re gonna do so much of the talking during the interview. Who does more of the talking during the interview? You or the candidate? What I my tendency is to do all the talking.

What, what I really, what I really need to do and want to do is I wanna ask questions that get the other person talking so I can hear more of, of who they are, what they value and yeah. Do, do I need them to have skills? I, I, I want them to have skills in a certain level but when I have the right person. If there’s a few skills they don’t have, they’re gonna go out and learn it. They’re, they’re gonna be so excited about what they’re gonna be doing for our company.

They’re gonna be learning it after hours. Think about that. They’re hung. The right people are, are humble. They’re hungry and they’re smart with people. And when I say hungry that doesn’t just mean they’re, that’s not money hungry. Ok. Of course, you know, you’ve got, you know, sales people, you want them to be motivated, you want to hire people that are motivated to, to make the sale and to earn a lot, right? But you want people that are, that are, that are hungry to grow and in a way, they’re hungry to give, they’re hungry people.

You don’t, who wants a piece of uh of, of jello from the high school lunch line uh uh sitting in their company wiggling around in their company just taking up space. No, we want, we want passionate people in our company. I want every single person in my company to be passionate about, about who we are, where we’re going about serving our client and their and their peace, uh their contribution to that. And guess what, when you hire passionate people, you’re going to end up having some passionate conversations internally as well.

And those can, those can, you know, cause some conflict I I want and my team, I, I want the most important issues to come to the top so that we can deal with, with them. What I don’t want is a bunch of artificial harmony. People pretending to get along, get along with each other just because I, you know, I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna rock the boat or I don’t want to deal with that person. I’m just gonna not say anything. I don’t want that. I want people who are passionate like, hey, I need to speak up about this and, and I want to make a space, I purposefully make a space in a safe place where people on my team can speak their, their view, their opinion.

It’s very important. I don’t want a bunch of yes men and women on my team. I need people that are passionate because they’re making decisions for me. I’m, I’m, I’m delegating things to people and I need them to uh I need to hear what they have to say and they need to hear what I have to say and we need to put all the, all the uh the information into that pool of knowledge so that we can extract what, what the best ideas are. Yeah, you don’t get to, to your size company.

You don’t get to all the different awards. You’ve won the employment Awards that I think you just won a businessman of the year or something. But yeah, that was, that was the small business, uh small business administration S B a, their, their Dallas Fort Worth office, uh, uh, selected me as their business person of the year for 2023. Yeah, it’s insane. Congratulations. Well, it’s easy to look great when you have a bunch of amazing people, people behind the scenes. Uh, you know, making you look great. That’s me.

I’m, I’m just, I’m just out front. Oh, you’re so, you’re, uh, definitely not just a dope but you’re, you’re humble and, and it’s, you don’t get to that level by just you being so smart. You know, you get to that level by you being smart enough to know how to hire and motivate the right team members to actually give them capacity and freedom to grow and help make your company better than you would have made it. One of the best feelings in the world is when you hire somebody, when we, when we’ve had people working and they go do something, I tell them, hey, here’s how you’re gonna do it and then they come back and be like, oh, hey, I changed a bunch of stuff because your way wasn’t really that good.

Here’s how we should do it. And I’m like, yeah, I’m kind of an kind of an idiot that’s, that’s much better. I triggered. So you triggered something right there. That reminded me 11 of the, one of the contractor, uh prison inmate mindsets is I’m smarter than everybody else. And when you have this, let’s just, let’s just say you’re super smart, you’re a get it done person, ok? You’re gonna, you’re gonna rise up to a level of success and you’re gonna feel like man, I did it. I’m doing this, I’m smart.

Nobody can do it as good as me. And then you’re gonna really get smart one day hopefully and you’re going to realize thing. I need other people. I need, I need someone who’s smarter than me uh in sales smarter than me in accounting, smarter than me in writing processes in production and doing this and doing that. I need people that are smarter than me. And when you, when you, when you realize that that you don’t want to be the smartest one at your company, not everybody is completely smarter than you everywhere else. OK?

But you’ve got people that are have specialized knowledge or skills because in our businesses, we have specific um skill sets that are needed for each of the major functions of our business. And as a as an entrepreneur, you know, we end up early on typically doing all of those and that’s what helps us get off the ground. As an entrepreneur is we can do all of those things um adequately but adequately is not going to take you to the next level. And that’s why you have to delegate the right things to the right people and let them take it higher. Yeah.

So as a reminder, there is a a link we’ll throw it back in the chat to allow stream yard to access your Facebook. Uh, stream air dot com forward slash Facebook. That way we can know who you are when you’re putting in the comments. Uh Sony says that you’re gonna run for President Jason and I’ll be vice president. I’m happy with that. I think we, we can make a strong case here. Uh, and Jordan Jordan and I were actually messaging yesterday. Uh, she wasn’t sure whether I was a real person who had messaged her.

Hi, Jordan. So she has a big question for you. Uh, and I’m gonna read it. I read it because a lot of people will listen to this via podcast or listen to the recording. Hi, Jason. I’ve appreciated all your advice on the podcast series. I’ve got a really specific question. I’ve been struggling with that. I think I have the answer to. I have a small startup with a few key people who are related to each other. I don’t have full time work for them yet and they are happy with part time.

One has expressed she would love to start her own company in a few years when their kids get older and schedule frees up more. Oh, no, Jordan, your question cut. Uh Can I see the whole thing? No, in the, in the meantime, she’s asked for more responsibility and, uh, can’t see anything past that, Jordan. That was a heck of a question. If you can post the rest in there, uh then we will be able to get an answer for you. But it does look like you got cut off.

So we got cut off after responsibility. So we’ll get back to Jordan’s question, but I don’t know if there’s something for you to start with here. Yeah, Brandon. Uh you know, um a couple, a couple of key things I’m, I’m looking at here is uh let me, let me, let me uh finish here. Sorry Jason. Uh Wow. And administrative sales project manager task with my company to learn. She’s very competent, but I hesitate to train her to do everything I do for fear that I’ll train a Darth Evader man.

I, I love this honesty. Thank you Jordan. That will be my direct competition and take the team with her in a few years. I am a niche market. I think she does high-end murals. Um and not many people train on it. I don’t like having this scarcity and fear based mentality. So how should I be looking at this? Should it be a real concern or should I just teach her everything I do and hope she appreciates probably appreciates it. Well, Jordan, that is um that’s a great question and that’s a real concern.

Am I gonna train? I mean if I’m hearing you right? You’re, you know, am I gonna train in my competition who’s just going to go out there and underbid me, you know, a year from now, that’s a real concern. And so on, on one hand, you could say, well, I’m not gonna train anyone and you can be, you know, you can close up your mind and close up your time and, uh, not take any risk. Ok. Well, that’s still not gonna prevent that person. If they really want to from becoming your competitor, they’ll just find another route.

That’s my first thing to say. Um, my second thing would be, uh, you know, just because you train them, doesn’t mean you have to train them ever to do everything and how to run the entire business. Is that really what you, what, what do you need her to do? Uh, I’m assuming this is, uh, the other ones, I, with this other person, what do you, how can they best serve your business? And, and again, at, at the end of the day, if, uh, you know, if, if you, if you invest into someone and they leave, that’s terrible if you don’t invest into someone and they stay, that’s terrible as well.

So, you know, it’s, it’s probably worth having, uh, an open and honest transparent conversation. That doesn’t mean that, that the other person is going to be transparent. But look, none of us want to train our competition at the same time just because you train them doesn’t mean they’re gonna, they’re gonna do it as good as you. We’ve had so many people through the years that have come through our doors and then wanna then want to go out and start their own company and very, very, very few of them make it very long because what they don’t understand is what it really takes to run a business.

They bite off more than they can chew and they, they, they end up staying in business for a short period of time and then they, then they exit. So, um I would just, I would start with transparency. Hey, here’s my goals. Here’s what I need and, and don’t necessarily give her and train her things that she wants to know just because she wants to know them, train her on things where she can add value to your business. That’s, and, and you’re already gonna be adding value to her at that point.

That would be my suggestion to you, Jordan. Yeah, I think that’s a great suggestion because Jordan, it sounds like she’s basically asking to learn your entire company. She says, hey, I want to start a company. I want more responsibility. I wanna do administration. I wanna do sales, I wanna do project manager. I wanna do all this other stuff. Uh What did you hire her for? What’s her actual role? Give her that allow her the opportunity to expand and it take on more responsibility. But unless you’re running an incubator, unless you’re, you’re in the business of training, you know, fellow entrepreneurs and business owners and, and doing a startup program of some kind, you, you’re not obligated to do all that for her.

Um, but yeah, you don’t want to limit people, but you also don’t need to, you’re not running an incubator. I don’t believe, I think you’re running a paint company sometimes. Brandon, there’s, there’s, uh, every now and then there’s a team member who’s like, hey, Jason, I want more, I want more. But what I really need from them is I need them to give more to what I’ve already given them. So think so, think about that as well, Jordan is, is she doing what you need her to do to the level?

That’s possible. Maybe she just needs to focus for now. Awesome for people who are listening. I do want to get a pulse on this. If you, if you listened to Jason’s series, if you heard our series, even if you didn’t listen to all of it, it was a lot and we did seven episodes if you can just put hashtag um listened, uh I’m not gonna ask you to put it if you didn’t, I’m not gonna ask you to say, didn’t listen. But if you did listen, I’d love to know that.

Listen, I gotta, I gotta put scarlet letters on anybody while we’re here. So another question we have, I have team meetings every Monday. How do you structure your meetings? How long are they? And what do you include outside of the purpose. Ok, great question. It depends on which team it is. Uh All of our teams do meet weekly. Um We generally find that, um Mondays isn’t a good day for us. Uh We love, we would love to meet on Mondays, but we need to hit the ground, uh running on Mondays, so we don’t meet on Mondays we have in the past.

Um But our, our leadership meetings uh are generally 90 minutes. Sometimes they’re less, sometimes they’re more we follow. Uh we follow loosely or, or not really loosely pretty, pretty closely. The um uh the E OS model for our level 10 meeting pulses. So that’s what every, every department uh follows. Now, uh our, our uh the way that plays out in each department can look slightly different, but the whole point of these meetings is of, of all of these meetings is to um do two things. Well, really, it’s to do one thing, it’s to identify, discuss and solve the most pressing issues that we have.

So we start uh one of the, one of the key ways to identify those issues is looking at our weekly scorecards. Have we, you know, let’s just take, uh you know, let’s just take sales for instance. Um Are we hitting our sales numbers? Are we, we have all the different, different sales metrics that we track? So the the thing is, is our meetings are not for information transfer. Do we transfer? And cascade information we do. But our meetings, our meetings are to, to put our heads together, discuss and solve the main issues which may be identified as a part of our, um, looking at our scorecards, but it may be, it may be something else.

And at the end of the day or at the end of the meeting, you know, you would want to get more yeses to this question than nos. Hey, team, if you had to pay five bucks to get into this meeting, would it have been worth your time? Would it would have been worth your five bucks? That’s, and, and, and see what they say. And so that the meetings need to be very valuable because what happens is we tend to have meetings that are not gender driven. We tend to find a small issue and chase it down for the entire meeting time and we never actually get to dealing with the most important issue.

And that’s why I highly recommend the, the E OS method of identifying those issues, uh, then prioritizing them and then starting to discuss once you’ve identified them all and prioritize them that we actually get to the, um, the most important decisions which are typically the most difficult ones. And the tendency throughout the meeting is to solve the easy issues as you go. And that’s interesting. Yeah, that is very, the, the $5 I’ve never thought about that. Like, would you actually have paid to come to this meeting? Did it provide that kind of value to you?

How do you identify? I mean, e O si think kinda kind of outlines this with the level 673 meetings, but let’s say other meetings that you might be having, how do you identify who needs to be there and who doesn’t like? Do you, do you narrow down meeting agendas and therefore narrow down the number of people who are going to be there or how do you present? How do you prevent wasted time? Ok. That’s, that’s, that’s important. We, we generally um so we have departmental meetings, plus we have a leadership meeting.

So for instance, we have a, we have a marketing L 10 meeting. We have one for our call center. We have one for our sales team, we have one for our accounting team and we have one for our production team. Then we have one for our leadership team. If I didn’t already say that and when you start thinking about how much money it costs and when we’re doing those meetings, we’re not actually getting things done. So those are very, very expensive meetings. And a lot of times we don’t want it to be a level 10 beating.

We want it to be a level 10 meeting and we really want it to be worth people’s time and we want to deal with issues that are gonna move the needle. So for instance, in our production department well, every single um again, we’re a subcontract model. Ok. So our production meetings are our production manager, our project schedulers which we call expediters, by the way. And our project managers, those are the people in those meetings. And a lot of times our field sales manager will attend those meetings as well because he has, they have some collaboration that they need to do.

But generally speaking, we want to then assign any issues that come up need to be. We don’t want 23 people to be in the meeting and three people to be solving the problem. If that’s what it is, those three people need to meet later and solve that problem and only deal with the issues that involve everybody during the meeting. Yeah. So you, I didn’t, I don’t think I’d ever caught this from you before. So I know you call your estimators, what other people call estimators? You call them project consultants because they’re not out there to estimate.

It’s not a guess they’re there to consult and, and a consultative sales process and make sure you’re the right fit for. Did you just say that your project managers there? They are called project expediters? No. So instead of instead of production schedulers, we have expediters and they schedule like Tetris, that’s their job is once, once a sale comes in the accounting system, basically processes the payment and puts a, let’s just say a template of a blank project into the C R M. And from there, the production department grabs it fills out all the remaining details that are pertinent and reviews the paperwork and the photos and this and that and this is the, this is the expeditor role.

They’re the production scheduler and they coordinate with the client all the way up until the night before or the day before when the project is assigned to a project manager and the baton is handed off to the project manager and he takes over the customer communication from there until the project is completely wrapped up. Got it. So I, I like the fact that, that you literally have, you have essentially what would be the, the successful outcome of that role, you named it that because what would you want in that role?

If someone’s scheduling it, you would want them to expedite, you’d want them to schedule this, ok? If you think about this. Well, um, if you, if you’re doing exterior work and you need to, you know, power wash or just prep a house that’s going to take half a day, you just gonna send the crew home the second half of the day or you gonna fill that extra hole, you need to find something for them to do. It takes extra effort to do that little something it could be, you know, starting prep on the next house or um in our world.

We, we want to keep the schedule booked out with uh, assigned to cruise for the next seven days. And, well, let’s say I’ve got, you know, um, rain in the schedule. Do I? It would be easier for me as a, as a project scheduler to say, oh, it’s gonna rain. Nope, we’re not, it’s not gonna, it’s gonna rain. We’re not putting anybody on the calendar because the headache is if you put them on the calendar and then it, it does rain. Now you’ve got to reschedule that person and anybody else that’s after them, which is work.

And, uh, but nothing makes me more angry. I say nothing makes me more angry. There’s a lot, I, I’ve got a few triggers but we called off work because because of potential rain and then there’s no rain. Ok? No, we will work and if it starts raining, we will go home. Other than that we’re showing up. Ok? Yes. Your job as an expeditor is to put the jobs on the calendar unless there’s a high likelihood of rain. And uh, yes, and you will be rescheduling stuff every time it rains when you’re doing your job properly. Yeah.

So I wanted to expedite it. Hurry up, let’s hurry up and help, get that job started so we can deliver those promises that in the dream that the client is looking for. Yeah, everything you do is very intentional. Jason. Um, it’s a lot of how you, how I think you’ve gotten to where you’re at one of the things that I like that. You said, that I think could be easily missed is you said meetings are expensive and I think that’s a, that’s a, that’s a business owner.

That’s a, it’s a medium to big business owners mindset. It’s oftentimes not a small business owner’s mindset, they would think a meeting is free and pay anything for that. But you’re, you’re recognizing the resources how, how expensive those people tied up in there, what you’re actually paying them. But then also the opportunity cost of what could be getting done outside of the meeting. So that meeting better be worth more than however many thousands of dollars you essentially just invested into that hour long meeting. But let me give you another example.

Let’s just say that um let’s say it’s uh you know, uh uh a Friday morning and um a two pm appointment calls and says, hey, I can’t meet today uh for that painting, quote, I need to reschedule for next week. So we reschedule them for next week. What do we do with that? Two o’clock? Hey, uh Mr project consultant, you’re free, you’re free for that hour. Why don’t you go get a haircut or whatever or just, you know, hang out or go home? No, our, our um call center agents, uh they’re gonna fight to find someone to fill that with because we probably have someone that’s on next week that really wanted it this week and we’re going to fill them up or maybe someone is already on the phone next, filling that up pretty quickly because those appointment slots, if you, if you took your annual revenue, you know, let’s just, let’s just say, you know, let’s use some easy numbers.

Say your annual revenue is, you know, $233 million and, and, and let’s say that, uh, in, in, uh, in a year you did 233 appointments. Well, that is an average of, of like $260 per appointment. And if you, if you miss that slot, you’re never going to get that appointment slot back. And it’s, it’s water under the bridge, it’s gone. And during, especially during spring time when you, when, when you can’t even get to all the appointments and then you have a slot that gets wasted or you either a, you don’t get to meet with someone or b you send your project consultant out there on to, to look at something that you don’t even do.

For instance, like, um, they wanted us to paint a swing set and you don’t paint swing sets or whatever it is, you just wasted. You didn’t just waste that the, the, the gas to drive over there. And the time of a commission salesperson, you wasted what you could have sold if you had, have had a proper appointment in that spot. And that, that’s, that’s the cost that’s missed opportunity is what that is. So the same holds true with appointments and, and with production as well. Missed time.

Lost time is money. Yeah. When you, and that’s a thing that, that’s lost on a lot of people, you know, they don’t understand the value of opportunity costs and that’s not just for bigger businesses like Phillips home improvements is, I would actually argue it’s, it’s more relevant for smaller businesses because you, time is your biggest, your scarcest resource. When you’re small, you don’t, you can’t afford to hire a huge team, meaning you and perhaps a handful of other people are having to do everything. So if you find yourself caught being inefficient or any member of your team being inefficient, um, you were going to pay a serious price for it.

You might not see that price but you paid it. That’s right. 267%. Yeah, Jason, I am obsessed with your sales process. Obsessed. I love it. I want to talk about it. We wanna talk more about it. Uh Brandon, you should, uh, uh, you should join us in, uh, in late October for Contractor Freedom Summit, which, oh, wait, you’re already gonna be there anyways, Contractor Freedom Summit. So, yeah, we’re, we’re having a, we’re, we’re hosting a summit for, uh, uh, it’s called Contractor Freedom. And, uh, for those who are wanting to escape or stay out of contractor prison and we’re going to, you know, we, we’ve talked through this series a lot, uh, and we give some examples but conceptually and theoretically about a lot of things.

But, but how do I actually set better appointments? How do I uh um run, how, how do I have a sales methodology, a sales system for my company? There’s I talked to a lot of guys, they, they’re like, I wanna, I wanna systemized my sales so I can train someone, you know, and, and of course, of course, there’s gonna be guys like you, they’re gonna speak to things that I don’t speak to like S E O and, and so I just, if anybody wants to, you know, dig in deeper and learn some pla practical application, I guarantee you, you’re gonna, you’re gonna, you’re gonna leave with practical things that you can implement in your business right away so that you can really either scale or um exit contract or prison or best, the best case scenario would be both.

Yeah, man, I cannot wait, I cannot wait for that event. So you’ll be super excited. Someone asked is, is it gonna be in Texas? It’s gonna be in Texas, it’s gonna be in the Dallas area. Awesome. Are we gonna see your headquarters? Will it be at your headquarters? It will not be at my headquarters. It will probably be close and we’ll probably do um uh a field trip and uh kind of walk through and, and show everybody. Uh exactly how, how we run things and see, you know, we, we’re pretty, I would say we’re pretty unique compared to, compared to most home improvement companies and the way we do things and um you know, we, we don’t have this, uh we don’t have this beautiful shop and spray booth and some of the stuff like you guys have and I look at y’all and I’m like, oh man, that’s so amazing that you guys do this.

We don’t have that, you know, we’re subcontractor model. So our, our office is all about uh um leads market. It’s all about appointments, training, scheduling projects. It’s all, it’s, it’s all administrative and training. But really, it’s, we have this, we have this one room. It’s, it’s our, it’s our meeting room and it’s really, we call it the great room. It’s the biggest room, it’s the great room and, and we say it’s where greatness grows and that’s where we have training going on almost every day of the week for either for everybody, everybody in the company, especially new recruits.

And so I’d like to, you know, I, I’d like to show uh show you guys who are, who, who come to the event. I’d like to show you around and, and how we do that. And we’re gonna, you know, we’re gonna teach, we’re gonna teach ourselves our sales method methodology. We’re gonna teach how we, how we set appointments. We’re also gonna teach how we um uh go after those um leads those appointments that didn’t buy from us. So if you recall on one of the, one of the previous episodes, we, we on marketing, we talked about what are the best leads and the best leads are not the fresh leads.

The best leads are the leads that we already have. And how do we go after those and get those? So we’re actually gonna uh you know, teach and train and, and script and role play exactly how we do that. Yeah, that’s amazing. So, yeah, I was, I am so invested and interested in Jason’s sales process that I actually was going to, to pay and come as an attendee prior to him asking me to speak there. So it is uh he’s got, he’s got some good stuff going on.

I’ve talked with a lot of painting company owners, I’d say many of, of the biggest ones in North America and Jason has something extremely special. You have a um you have a sales like a sales scoreboard, right? Or something. Leader, leader board. Are we gonna see it? Yeah. Why not? Absolutely. Yeah, we just had um uh we hit all of our, we hit all of our uh quarter one goals which were, which were uh which were pretty lofty. We were super happy about that. And then uh April uh we, we um we, our team really, really, really did amazing and uh they, they contracted um their goal I think was a million and 240.

And on the last day of the month, which happened to be a Sunday. They um exceeded that by I think like, you know, almost $703,270. So they really, they just uh I celebrate these guys. They are amazing. Yeah, that was incredible, man. When you sent you, Jason sent me a text on that, that day, uh our Facebook Facebook message and I was extremely excited to see that. So we have some questions now about your sales, your sales process. So I am interested Jason in your salary and incentive structure for sales people.

Ok. So um let’s start here. Um The salary looks like this. It’s a big fat zero. Our, our sellers, our, our sales people are 224% commission and I’m not saying that that um a salary is wrong. I’m not saying that, but this is our, this is our model. We are 248% commission. Our uh sales people are people that want to be 100% in control of what they make and uh we want to put them in the driver seat for that. So um now having said that they have the option when they bring in a uh a contract with a, with a deposit, they can get half of their commission up front so they can get some money immediately.

But there’s nothing that’s guaranteed. I am already giving them uh leads, I’m giving them a vehicle and benefits and leads, leads are our leads are expensive. Gotten more expensive leads are expensive. Exactly. And, and they get, they’re getting more expensive every day. And I’m, I mean, I’m investing thousands of dollars in leads just for, to give to a guy. And so, um, uh, yeah, so I’m not, I’m not giving him a salary too. Um, that, that’s just the way we do it again. I know plenty of other people that, that have a, a salary and salary plus commission, uh positions.

But for, but for us it’s a, it’s 100% commission. They can get half of their commission with a, with a deposit. And, um, they also have, um, monthly metrics where if, if they sold a certain amount for the previous month and their net sale per lead issued was high enough, then they can get a little bonus or incentive on top of that as well. And additionally, um, our, our, our sales team is working on hitting a stretch goal, which is 10% over our regular goal for the year and there’s some, definitely some additional money tied tied to that for them monthly as well.

Ok. So someone’s asking if, if it’s a percent of the contract, I guess, would it be percent of revenue, um probably, or do you gross profit or how do you do that? Oh, good question. Good question. The easy thing to do is to pay them a percentage of the gross profit. I used to do that and I’m convinced it’s a terrible idea and I’ll never do it again. And that’s because, um, if, if your sales person is constantly thinking about what the raw labor material cost is to do a project, they’re never going to fully believe in the price you’re charging.

And therefore they won’t be able to sell it at that price. So they’re going to sell it for less or they’re not going to sell it all. So I want to protect their mindset and I want them to only think about the price that we charge for the work because they don’t understand the marketing. They don’t understand the insurance, the overhead, the uh fuel expenses, uh All of the other mountain of expenses that go into, um, you know, producing, producing a job, running a business. So I don’t want them thinking about raw costs.

I want them thinking about the list price. And so what does that mean? That means that, that um so, so the easy way would be, well, I’m gonna let I’m gonna pay you based on gross profit. If you sell it for less, you’re gonna make less. If you sell it for more, you’re gonna make more. So it puts them in control of profitability. Why not create a pricing system? That is easy for them to learn. That has uh the, the profit model built into it. So, what I want my guys to do is I just want them to count.

Hey, we’ve got this many windows to talk. We’ve got, you know, this many window sills to repaint whatever it is. And I just want them to fill in numbers, you know, is this primate or one code or two code? Is it on the first story? The second, I just want to put in basic stuff and then boom, here’s how much you have to charge for this. So that’s, that’s the way we do it. And that’s really interesting because if they’re putting in the numbers and they know, ok, it’s a $10,000 job and they’re not having to think.

Well, you know, if I could sell it for like X Y or Z or the, the profit might, might be hurt, but they just have the number. Well, then they can focus on what you guys really specialize in which is the, the consultative sales process, understanding the needs of the homeowner, making sure that you’re positioning you’re offering with what they are actually looking for, making sure it’s the right fit, going through the, the, the script and the process of sitting down at the kitchen table, they can focus on this stuff because the numbers are essentially a given for them.

So here’s ok. Let, let’s look at it this way. It’s Friday Brandon been a slow week for sales. I really need to make something, I’d rather make something rather than nothing. So I’m going to make sure I leave here with a sale and now all of a sudden this guy is not selling value. He’s selling price and any time your people start selling and competing on price, you as a company owner are going to lose. Yeah, that’s a great point. So you’ve, you’ve taken that responsibility and also option away.

So the, the temptation, I guess if you will, the temptation to be like, you know what, I’m not gonna make as much, but I’ll make something that temptation is not removed. Correct, man. That’s cool. Uh Someone let me move up here. Someone said, what C R M do you use uh to follow all of your leads slash K P I? Ok. So we have, we have quite an extensive tech stack F Y I and um uh I, we use a uh um AC R M called Improve It 3 40.

And I do not, I do not recommend this for most companies unless you literally have like a full time I T guy or you’re extremely tech savvy and have a lot of time to implement it. Um So, yeah, we, it, it works great for us and um I’m very glad we have it and I’m not looking to change, but if you’re looking for AC R M or you’re only running, you know, uh a couple million or less, I definitely would not recommend it for you. It’s not the right size for your company.

Yeah, and Jason, you have a bit of a background. I mean, you’re into this stuff, into the sales and marketing. You’ve been doing it for a lot of years. You’ve, you’ve been into C R M. So you didn’t, you’re not the traditional painting company owner. That’s just, hey, I, I need to manage my leads. How do I do it? This was already a passionate, you know, passion of yours. So you went into this with, with a bit of a different mindset and background I think. Yeah. And I wrote my own, my first C R M was all I wrote it from scratch myself and hosted it on my own servers and such.

And I wanted to go to the cloud and the platform I was using wasn’t really cloud compatible. And so I started looking around and the one we use now is based on sales force which is best in class cloud based system. So that’s what we went with and, and I don’t have to worry about is it running? You know, I can, I can make it do anything I want, I can make it do anything I wanted to do. But you have to know you have to be, you know, real technically inclined.

Yeah, basically software engineer. So someone, someone mentioned drip jobs. Yeah. Drip jobs, Tanner Mullen and a lot of, a lot of people are really happy with drip jobs. And so that’s, that is my go to recommendation for, for most everybody that I meet. Yep, someone asked Jason, would you feel the same if your salesman also was the production manager or they essentially had a dual role? Ok. So, um no, for instance, um if, if you’ve got a sales person who’s also managing those projects, uh then, then, well, I’ll say this, there are some companies that just say, hey, look, I’m gonna pay you this percent or whatever to, to sell the project and this percent to run the project.

There are people that do that. Uh, matter of fact, a lot of roofing companies do it that way. But, uh, if you have someone, ultimately, ultimately, your goal needs to be, to split that role. Ok. But in the short term, you’re probably going to have to have a combination. You don’t have to, but you’re likely going to have a combination where they’re going to be on salary and commission. But depending on who they are, they’re going to find more reward on their time doing one or the other and one or the other is going to get their attention.

So, um, they’re gonna get more of their attention. So I would shoot as a growth path for you. I would try to separate those roles. Yeah, it’s interesting you say one or the other is going to get their attention because they are pretty different, you know, they’re gonna attract different kinds of people. And ever since you and I started, um, connecting, I think a couple of years ago and, and became friends and we’ve, I’ve learned a lot about disc through you. Uh I’ve noticed the mistakes that I’ve made in painter, marketing pros and I go back and I look at the disc profile and I, I realize that was never a good fit.

And so I can personally attest to the through some painful experiences to the importance of the personality match to the fit of the role. Um It’s vital, it’s, it’s absolutely vital. You know, how many of you guys that are listening actually use um personality profiles as a part of your, as a part of your hiring process, your interviewing process. I’d be curious, I’d be curious to know if you, if you do it, if you could put a hashtag personality profile, something like that in the chat that would be cool to see.

Um It’s, and it’s interesting as I’ve grown as an entrepreneur and business owner and, and gotten bigger. All this stuff that had previously sounded kind of like malarkey or BS, you know, the, the culture and the fit and the, the motivation and some of that stuff just sounded like they were nice words. It actually is, it actually is business. It actually is what takes you to that level. Uh which is what this whole, this whole series was about. People make dream businesses. And Jason, you’re, you’re uh you make no, um you’re very, very transparent about the fact that you believe people are what business is being good with people motivating, selling it.

It’s all about people. We are really in the people business for sure. Yeah, especially as a service company, especially as a service company. Yeah, we’re not, we’re, we’re not filling a factory, you know, with, with product, we’re out, we are people serving people out in the communities. Yeah. So someone said, what percentage do they get? I think going back to the um the project consultant, you know, the estimator for other people, for example, my estimator gets 10% of the total invoice. So revenue, how do you account for vehicles and benefits for estimators?

Does it cut into their percentage or is it above and beyond their percentage? So our guys get get 10% plus um plus the vehicle, you know, plus a fuel card plus benefits all on top of that. Ok. 10% with everything else. Awesome Jason uh the the sale you don’t hear back, you’ve gone out, you’ve conducted, you know, it’s my favorite thing. You’ve gone out, you’ve conducted the estimate you haven’t heard back, you send a second person out there. Can you please just go through this? Because I’ve never heard anyone else talk about this before.

Ok, we have, you have to know this, I’m just, I’m just a loose cano at this man. I I love this one. Let’s let’s just use some round easy numbers. Your rates may be slightly different. Ok? But just just go with me for a minute. Um, let’s just say that your closing rate on, on all appointments, not the good appointments, all appointments. Ok. Um, is one in 3 33%. So 33% buy from you 60 you know, 67 don’t, statistics say that 40% of that 67%. Actually, it’s more than that, I believe. Um, it might be 70% of that remaining is going to buy from someone in the near future.

Why aren’t they going to buy from you? Well, your salesperson thinks that it’s because they’re tire kickers or price shoppers and worse yet, maybe that’s what you think as the business owner. And if that’s what you think, then you need to rethink your thinking and I’m not trying to be rude here to you. But what I’m saying is, is, it’s not about the price. If you are, if you are selling to homeowners, it’s not about the price. It is about the value, it’s about the urgency. It’s, it’s about the, um, rapport, the trust, the peace of mind, the expertise, it’s different.

So the fact is this is that, you know, if someone didn’t buy, they, they, they simply didn’t buy because we did not build enough value and, or we didn’t build urgency or we didn’t build credibility or expertise. And so if, if, if you send someone else out there, heck maybe the, maybe the, maybe the homeowner had a bad day maybe your guy smelled bad that day because he’d been out in the sun and he was sweaty and they, and it, and it bothered them. Maybe, maybe that prospect that homeowner didn’t like the way your guy or gal looked.

There’s so many reasons, maybe they were distracted with the kids that they didn’t buy and now your sales people are on to the next appointment. Great sales people are terrible. Follow up. They’re terrible. Follow upper. That’s, you know, not a great word but you know what it means. And, and so re engaging those same leads that you already have will likely be some of your best leads. Now, at our company, the way we do it, you may have to do it a little different if you’re the only one selling.

Um excuse me, but at our company, hey, we just make a little customer service call the next day, the next day and it’s, and it, and it just kind of goes something like this. Um uh uh, hi Brandon. Hi Brandon. This is Jason. I’m the cus, I’m the client service uh manager over here at Phillips. And uh I, I see that, I see that uh Matt was out to meet with you yesterday at, at three PM and uh just, just customer customer service call had a couple quick questions.

Um Do you have two or three minutes? Sure, great. Ok, great. So then we just ask a series of basic customer questions? Hey, was he on time? You know, did he, did he, uh uh was he able to look at all the, all the, uh uh the entire project? Was he able to answer all your questions? Did he show you colors? Did he talk to you about your different options? And um we may uncover that there was some dissatisfaction and if there was some dissatisfaction with that part of it.

Well, I’ve got a conversation I need to have with my guy Matt most of the time they’re singing his praise. Oh, no, Matt was great, man. We love your company. Oh, yeah, it was great. Oh, wow. Thank you so much for thank you Brandon for sharing that with me. Um uh I, I appreciate your time but hey, uh uh one more thing before we go, um I don’t see that you placed. Uh uh uh uh you didn’t, I, I don’t see that you got it on the schedule with us.

Can I ask why? So now you’re gonna get the real reason why they didn’t buy. And it’s highly likely that that reason is different than what your sales person told you or different than what you think. So, this call needs to be made by a different person than the person who ran the appointment. And so, uh so from there, we just, uh we, we, we roll out into a um you know, process of getting, getting the next guy to, to getting our field sales manager over there to take a look at it.

Did we really give them the best price that we could or was it something else? And so our conversion rate on those is really high. Our average sale on those is really high. And, um, about half the time actually comes back with a bigger ticket than was originally quoted. However, almost everybody ignores these open leads because they just write them off as well as their tire kickers. Price shoppers. Think about how insane that is. Nobody does this, right. It, it’s all you. What’s the best case scenario?

What some of the better companies are following up? Or maybe they put them in an, in an automation which if you’re not doing that, you should be doing that. I know drip jobs does it, we do it. Um And then, and then you’re kind of hoping that they come back a lot of companies that by far the majority of them never do anything. They just go out and they, oh, I’ll send you the estimate, send it 24 48 hours email investment. And then that, that’s that. Oh, they didn’t move forward lost deal.

Jason’s calling from a very customer centric mindset. It’s not, hey, this is Jason. I’m following up. Why didn’t you give us the money? You know, are you, do you wanna pay us? It’s, hey, I just wanna make sure the process went great. Let me let me, you, you have a, you have a second, I’m gonna respect your time because your time is valuable. Ok, great. Was he on time? Did he meet your needs? Right? You’re approaching it from their concern. He’s on sending someone else out because he approached it the right way and closing a high percentage of these leads of these estimates that essentially every other painting company is going to be a lost lead.

That’s powerful if that’s why you should come to the contractor summit if you’re listening to this and, and you weren’t sure before, you should be sure. Now, yeah, we’re, we’re, we’re gonna go over that as well. Yeah. So that and I know I’ve just, I’ve just gotten gotten bits and, and pieces and you and you and I have actually talked about this more at length and I know it’s, it’s something that is, is a very, very big, it’s a big initiative um for you and, and kind of dumping a little too much on people too quickly would actually potentially actually be, be harmful.

Uh If you don’t really fully understand how to integrate all this stuff. So it’s that powerful. There were two other comments I just want to get through real fast um because we are running out of time here. I want to respect everyone’s time. Jordan said I, I have my team take this yesterday and I’m going to start using it to find balance. We’re all the same type. That’s great. Jordan. A lot of people like to hire people who are like them. Um, which sounds like is what you did, but then it does create problems.

So that’s good that you see that. Uh, and then someone else said, oh, I got two more. How fast do you, how fast do you call? Is it the next day after your presentation? Yes, I think Jason you said is the next day, right? Ok. And then the last one and then we’re going to wrap up. How can you give us examples of good slash ideal personality profiles for both sales and project managers? Ok. So it, I’m gonna preface this by saying it depends on what your sales process looks like and it depends on, um, what your production process looks like because what, you know, what works for me is not necessarily what works for you, you know, are you, are you one, are you selling commercial?

Are you selling B to B are you selling, uh direct to consumer, you know, to homeowners? Those are, those are different. OK. We do, uh, short cycle sales because we know that, um, when people, when, when homeowners call us, it’s highly likely they’re gonna buy from someone within three days, it’s highly likely. And so, um, I need someone who’s going to be a fast paced person to get in there. Now, you may have a different uh uh sales cycle or sales uh methodology. Rather where, where you always, you’re gonna go out, you’re gonna take it back, you’re gonna, you know, if, if, if you’re doing more design and, and it takes time to put quotes together hours and you’re coming back with, with visualizations and all of that, you’re gonna connect on a, on a different level than we are.

So um in, in my company, um we uh the, the, the profiles that, that uh that Excel, well, in our culture are um D I and DC. And again, it’s not just that simple, but that’s, that’s it. If you just, if you just go and say, hey, I’m gonna hire D I S and D CS to do this job, that’s, that’s not a magic bullet. It’s a great place to start though. And now, now project managers, again, it depends on what you have them doing, but generally speaking, you know, you, you want someone who’s really gonna love on that client, who’s gonna take their time with that client and that person, that person could be um AAA different profile that, that has maybe some C and some ss in there more so than the more so than the salesperson.

Thank you, Jason. Jason. As we wrap this up, we’re a little bit past the hour. Is there anything else you wanna add or a wrap up for this uh for this series and this live Q and A, you know, you know, frankly, frankly, Brandon, I, I just wanna know that um I’m adding value to people honestly because I, I went through, you know, contract to prison and I built my company up and I built it wrong and I, I scraped it to almost to the ground and rebuilt it again.

And hey, if this, if, if, if something is really resonated with you um through, through today or any of the previous seven, I would, I would love to, you know, if you throw it in the comments or even you, gosh, you could send me uh A PM and let me know, I just, I want, I want to help you, you know, live your life on your terms without having to uh be a slave to your, to your business. And it’s, it’s doable you if, if you’re, if you’re like ready to throw in the towel or you’re like, man, how do we do this?

I’m so sick of fighting this fight, I’m ready to give up, but there’s hope, OK? And it, it, it comes down to a few things and, you know, focusing on the right things and uh you know, be being growing as a leader, building a team and, and empowering your team with simple systems. Those that’s just the, the core messages of it. There’s a lot that goes into it, but, but you can do it. I believe in you. If I did it, you can do it because you’re a smart person.

Love it. Man. And if you’re listening to this in the Facebook group, if you’re listening to the recording, you can still comment on it. You can tag Jason directly in the Pan American Mass podcast forum on Facebook. Let him know what’s resonating the most with you. Uh Jason is a servant leader, so he gets a lot out of that. Jason, thank you brother. We spent a lot of hours together, man. We spent a lot of hours together on this and I enjoy every one of them. Yeah. Thank you so much, man. Thank you everyone for attending. Uh Hope you, hope you drive a lot of value. Thank you for the kind comments and we’ll see you on the next one.

If you want to learn more about the topics we discussed in this podcast and how you can use them to grow your painting business, visit painter marketing pros dot com forward slash podcast for free training, as well as the ability to schedule a personalized strategy session for your painting company. Again that URL is paintermarketingpros.com/podcast.

Hey there, painting company owners. If you enjoyed today’s episode, make sure you go ahead and hit that subscribe button, give us your feedback, let us know how we did. And also, if you’re interested in taking your painting business to the next level, make sure you visit the Painter Marketing Pros website at Painter Marketing Pros dot com to learn more about our services. You can also reach out to me directly by emailing me at Brandon at Painter Marketing Pros.com and I can give you personalized advice on growing your painting business until next time.